Ashim Matthan: Hi everyone. Welcome to the RhinoMight podcast. My name is Ashim. This is Dr. Kanishka. So, today’s question is going to be about using Anavar and Clen for fat loss for women. So, this question was posted on steroidsxx. And this lady wants to know if she can use Anavar and Clen to drop body fat because she wants to look good. She wants a boost to confidence and she wants to go on holiday in November. And she’s 97 kilos in weight and she is 5 feet 11 inches tall. And she wants to take/add Clen to her Anavar stack because she thinks it’s going to help with her weight loss. She’s doing strength training in the gym, and she’s going to be maintaining a calorie deficit. And she’s mentioned strength training and calorie deficit. What I think of is that she’s extremely proactive as a patient, a really good patient to have. She seems to be really on top of her game with, in terms of for her investment into herself, her goals. So, yeah, what’s the short answer?

Dr. Kanishka Jain: Short answer is definitely, you can use these compounds.

Ashim Matthan: Like these compounds are great. Anavar and Clen, have been used before for fat loss. They have a weird sort of synergy, it’s not the type of synergy that we would play with but it is good because Anavar is like a recomping agent. It’s going to also make her hit in new PRs, she is going to love the feeling of it because it’s going to make her very, very strong. So, performance wise in the gym she is going to be performing very well, she is going to probably set new PRs. And that’s going to make her very happy. And Clen on the other hand is a fat burner, Clen is a wonderful oral tablet, both of these are oral tablets.

Dr. Kanishka Jain: Yeah. So, we wouldn’t plan this in that way.

Ashim Matthan: This is not the way we would go about it at all. I know that, so the one thing that we have to take into account is, in our system we have to sort of like change it because she has a deadline where by November she has to bring her A-Game to the table. So she has to be her really, really good by November. And I think she has quite a bit of fat loss to have, she’s mentioned it’s quite a bit. Yeah, that’s what she describes it. So, we’re looking at a lot of fat loss, we also got to assume with that fat loss that there’s a lot of skin… lose skin that would form so we’d have to tighten that up. And then, okay, so let’s go, how would we do it? Let’s make steps.

Dr. Kanishka Jain: Yeah, so our plan would be that step one that we would use HRT. She has not mentioned that she’s using HRT or not but we would start with HRT where we use three sex hormones which are bioidentical for woman that is Testosterone, Estrogen and Progesterone, where Estrogen would be done in the form of gels, Progesterone would be done in the form of tablets or gels and Testosterone would be done in the form of either gels or injections.

Ashim Matthan: Yeah. We prefer injections. That’s sort of like preferred choice because it’s the best bang for your buck. And as long as the patient is okay with needles and she’s not apprehensive and scared about them. And I think that this lady in question is not very comfortable about needles because both the chemicals that she’s talked about are oral tablets. We have no idea what her medical history is. All we know, she could be already on HRT, but if HRT is dialed-in correctly, it should already cause a significant amount of body change. And her boost in confidence should happen with HRT. We would know that we’ve done a good job with HRT if she’s already… if we check off these two points, these two goals of hers, it means that we’re on the right track.

Dr. Kanishka Jain: Yeah, with a good dialed-in HRT she would meet her goals.

Ashim Matthan: Especially because she’s doing strength training and which means she has activity and she’s also going to be maintaining a good diet. So all the more reason for this to work synergistically well with that.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah.

Ashim Matthan: Okay, so step one, we play with HRT, these three compounds, Progesterone, Estrogen and Testosterone. Step two, is that we add Hormone Supplementation to that. We play with T3 and T4.

Kanishka Jain: These are the complete Thyroid Supplementation.

Ashim Matthan: Right.

Kanishka Jain: So, that would be done in the form of tablets as well. Right? Yes.

Ashim Matthan: So, these are oral tablets. And also, I just want to move a little bit off track, but I want to mention, she’s talked about using Clen. You would never take Clen, we would never advice Clen without T3 and T4. We’re also going to mention Growth Hormone just a little bit down the line. And if you’re going to be using Clen and Growth Hormone, you always take thyroid supplementation with that.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah, to maximize. They work in a synergistic system, right?

Ashim Matthan: Also, that if you take Clen and Growth Hormone, they tend to burn off your T3 or T4.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah.

Ashim Matthan: And then you want to make sure that supplementation is going on so that you have the best effects.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah. You’re getting like the maximum effects from these kinds of compounds.

Ashim Matthan: Right. So, step one — HRT. Step two — HRT plus Thyroid Supplementation. Step three — HRT plus Thyroid Supplementation plus if she can afford it, we would do IGF4 level test and we would supplement Growth Hormone. If she cannot afford Growth Hormone, then we would do Clenbuterol as the next option. And if she can afford both then we would add GH and Clen. So, 3a is like GH, 3b is Clen, 3c is Clen plus GH, both of them being used.

Kanishka Jain: So, and I think Step four would be just all of these things plus Anavar in the recomp.

Ashim Matthan: Yes, the full package.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah, the full package.

Ashim Matthan: But if we do our job properly, she would not need to go to step four. I think that, see when you’re talking about like fat loss, Growth Hormone, its strategic value, it is a wonderful tool for fat loss. It is the best fat burning agent. We like it as a slow fat burning. But it is slow. Right now we’re running on a deadline. She wants to be like all set by November. So we’d have to play it a little differently.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah. We’re going to have to play a little differently where we do the HRT, we optimize her, we keep reassessing her after every month, every two to three weeks actually, because we are running on a deadline.

Ashim Matthan: Yeah. So we would… Sorry, go on.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah, and we would wait for the optimization to happen. In two to three weeks, we are able to judge that, is this patient responding very, very well to the dose, which has been there. Our first step would be to not add more compounds, but to increase the dose of the compounds that she already has, get them optimized and then decide if something else needs to be added to this protocol or not.

Ashim Matthan: Exactly. So like, you know, most women are very, very scared who’ve got Testosterone, they’re very apprehensive, because they feel it’s going to make them very manly and there’s going to be virilization that’s going to take place.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah. Like growth on the face.

Ashim Matthan: Yeah, hair growth on the face.

Kanishka Jain: Hair growth on the face.

Ashim Matthan: Right.

Kanishka Jain: Manly voice.

Ashim Matthan: Deep husky voice is going to start they’re worried about their clit as well. And like, what you have to do is, when you’re taking these compounds, you have to be very self-vigilant, self-monitoring yourself. If you start noticing that something’s out of whack, like you’re getting hair growth where you didn’t have it before or anything like that, you have to immediately dial-down the dose. So all of these side-effects take place when the dose is too much. So, the antidote to a high dose is that you cut down on your dose and it sort of corrects itself if you do it early on. If you wait and you… because you know what happens with Testosterone, high Testosterone means high libido.

Kanishka Jain: Yes.

Ashim Matthan: Okay, so they’re going to enjoy a great sex life, and they might be carried away with it initially and they might go, like oh, it’s little bit of hair growth, it’s okay, I’m having a lot of sex, I’m enjoying it. So why not? And it’s fine. I’ll do my waxing or bleaching or whatever it is that they prefer. And they sometimes let things slide. But long-term that’s not the right thing to do because if you keep any of these side-effects in play, for long-term, they would become permanent. And the way to avoid them becoming permanent is that as soon as they start showing themselves, STOP. Cut back on your dose. So we normally take a very, very low dose of test to start with for.. 5…

Kanishka Jain: 5 mg to 25 mg per week.

Ashim Matthan: Exactly. So 5 mg to 25 mg per week, which is very minuscule compared to what gentlemen, for what men use. So with ladies it’s 5 to 25 and sometimes depending on the preference of the patient we can do like daily injections of like 1 mg to 2 mg every day on a short acting ester or medium acting ester, because Testosterone Enanthate will keep compounding on itself in effect. It just takes a while for Testosterone, that’s all. But whether it is Testosterone Enanthate or Propionate it doesn’t really matter. We stay away from Sustanon and long acting mixture of Esters. We stay away from that.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah, we keep the release of the Testosterone very, very stable. We don’t allow the fluctuations to happen. So that’s how you avoid the side effects of the fluctuation of Testosterone.

Ashim Matthan: Exactly. And also with like Sustanon, we don’t know if the mixture is homogenous or not, like, which means that If say Sustanon has four different Esters that are there in it, four different Testosterone Esters, and they’re not in equal proportion. So if you are taking out a small amount, so within this in-equal proportion of Testosterone Esters, in a say, 1ml vile of it, you don’t know whether like every little bit of it that you take out has them in the same proportion.

Kanishka Jain: And you’re not able to predict the peaks with that.

Ashim Matthan: Exactly. So things could go out of whack and you don’t want those types of levels to take place. So we like to play with Test Cyp, Test Prop or Test Enanthate. You stick to one of these three. And if the patient is very, very apprehensive and does not want to use injections, we go with gels and gels are the next best option on the table.

Kanishka Jain: Yes.

Ashim Matthan: Okay. So, we optimize these three levels.

Kanishka Jain: So, can we just do a summary of what-what we will do as steps?

Ashim Matthan: Yes.

Kanishka Jain: So for this patient who’s 97 kilos, who’s 5’11, wants to lose weight, is on a time crunch, wants to get in shape by November, our step one should be HRT with three sex hormones that is, Estrogen, Progesterone, Testosterone. Then on that, on the top of this after reassessment, we would want to add T3, T4. And if these things are also not able to have the desired effect that you want, you would want GH. Another thing that we forgot to add, GH also causes lot of skin tightening. So, when you lose a lot of body fat, you’re going to have a lot of loose skin. So to tighten that GH will help. It lays down good tissue which is going to tighten everything.

Ashim Matthan: Right. So, all of her womanly curves and the confidence that she wants could be further accentuated and she would definitely want that.

Kanishka Jain: Yes. So, on top of that, if you cannot afford GH, we would run Clen or we would run Anavar on top of everything else afterwards, that would be our step four, that will be our last step.

Ashim Matthan: Yes. So, all of these chemicals work really well as, like in synergy until you get that Anavar because Anavar is more like, I won’t say muscle building, but it’s like a recomping agent, more of a recomping agent. So in some senses like she would be able to perform better and therefore be more active, whether in a roundabout way, because she’s going to be more active if she burns up more calories so stamina-wise she would increase. Yes. There would be an increase. And that’s what she will do. But if we’ve done our job properly, if we have optimized our hormones, if we’ve played with thyroid correctly, and if we have GH or Clen and/or Clen to play with, then that’s good enough. You would not need anything else. The only problem is that this is on a time crunch. So if she loses too much weight, there might be like loose skin, in which case using Anavar is wise, because it would cause like a little bit of hardening of the muscles, a recomping thing which would tighten… it will somehow cosmetically tighten it up more than Growth Hormone because Growth Hormone doesn’t work in such short burst of time if you don’t want to overload GH. Even though sometimes when we use GH we do front load a little bit but with the Growth Hormone, those are like really, really tiny compared to what we use for men.

Kanishka Jain: Yeah. Like, let’s say that in comparison, a woman’s dose might be like 0.25 IU a day, that’s not even like one fourth, it’s usually one fourth of a guy’s dose.

Ashim Matthan: Exactly. So, this is how we do it. So, yeah. You want to add anything else to this?

Kanishka Jain: Just the T3, T4 that we forgot to discuss. With T3, T4, we could always have controlled chaos protocol, where we taper off the dose slowly and we take it down, very, very slowly so that there are, no long-term hypothyroidism or there is no long-term side-effects of it.

Ashim Matthan: Exactly. So, thyroid is a gland that is extremely resilient. So if you are responsible with your T3, T4 medication and supplementation, it’s very, very unlikely, almost unheard of, I won’t say impossible so I will say extremely unlikely and unheard of for someone to develop Hypothyroidism because of, responsible, T3, T4 supplementation.

Kanishka Jain: So, the goal is, in short, that you go slow, be steady, you reassess and then you decide to add other compounds.

Ashim Matthan: Yeah. So we would go about like that. And almost everything is bioidentical for a large chunk of this. Your three sex hormones are bioidentical hormones, your T3, T4 is also bioidentical. And then you have Growth Hormone, also bioidentical. So, within the spectrum of bioidentical hormones before you get Clen, as Clen is not there in your body. It’s not bioidentical. And then Anavar also, same principle applies. It’s not part of your system. So these are like foreign substances that you bring to the table, maybe towards the end. But because you’re on a time crunch, we would consider them to be added in maybe early on just to see.. just because we don’t have the luxury of waiting for Growth Hormone to take its actual results and bring them to the table.

Kanishka Jain: Or if you see that the goals are not being met.

Ashim Matthan: Yeah.

Kanishka Jain: Like what we expect them to be like, what we expect the results and they are not meeting those requirements. And we can definitely add Clen, Anavar and these compounds but in a very controlled manner, in a very, very monitored manner.

Ashim Matthan: Right. Okay. So that’s all for today. Thanks a lot for watching this video. If you have any questions, please feel free to ask us. And we’ll see you next time. Thank you.

Kanishka Jain: Bye.